Dual pricing (Thai price and farang price) has long been a subject of contention among the expat community.
While most holiday makers probably don't realise a dual economy exists, even though they may pay up to a third more than a Thai would on many items in tourist area, the large majority of expats grumble at paying more for goods and services than locals.
And this is totally understandable. I mean, once you’ve lived in a country for five or so years, you’d expect to be treated like a local, right?
Multiple (dual) pricing evolved from the barter economy. (Image Credit: Samuel John Roberts @ Flikr)
It isn’t just street stalls and local shops that operate a dual economy, either. Many museums and national heritage sites stipulate dual pricing on entry, which is never usually more than a hundred Baht’s difference, but enough of a difference to make one feel discriminated against.
However, the reality is that outside of the tourist hotspots, purchases from local markets are generally priced the same, unless you know the owner personally. But when it comes to museums, heritage sites and other attractions, foreigners are usually expected to pay more.
But before we spout off about Thais being racist and how unfair it is, it is important to understand why a dual economy exists, and how it is potentially beneficial to some Thais — even though we might lose out at times.
A Sprinkle of Historical Context
The first mistake Western critics tend to make is to compare the evolution of Thailand's economy side-by-side with that of the UK or US, for example.
Thailand's capitalist economy as it exists today is very immature, and is often referred to as a pseudo-capitalist economy that presents itself as such but operates quite differently in many pockets of the country.
In fact, many of the older generation still alive today will have grown up in a rural barter-type economy. Indeed, my wife's grandmother did.
She still talks of swapping goods in her childhood and people lending their skills to each other in exchange for food and household essentials.
Only one hundred odd years ago the majority of the male population in Siam (Thailand) was in the service of court officials, while their wives and daughters may have traded on a small scale in local markets. And only at the end of World War 2 did Thailand's economy truly begin to become globalised.
Also consider that Thailand has not experienced the immigration and subsequent “multi-culturalism” that Europe and the US has. In comparison, Thailand has very few foreigners, and trade laws and the buying of land and housing is still very restrictive for foreign nationals.
Thais still very much do things the “Thai way”, and in the way they see fit.
And yes, for many this means ‘preference pricing', which, by the way, is not restricted to foreigners. I for one get my fruit cheaper than other local Thais because I am friends with the seller. This is a friendship built over around five years. That's how things still work here. Communities are very much localised, even in a big city like Bangkok.
Money Vs. Feelings
The fact that the difference between the “Thai price” and the “farang price” is usually quite small — certainly for entry to heritage sites and museums — suggests the grumbling is more about feelings that money.
This is understandable. It is a feeling of being discriminated against, a feeling that no matter how long we’ve been in the country we will always be treated as, and identified as, foreigners (“farang”).
On the face of it, this differential treatment is prejudice, and I’ve even heard some liken it to 50s America and the preferential treatment of whites over blacks. But the reality is it’s nothing like that at all.
The dual economy is born out of simple economics. Nothing more. If you believe that the elimination of dual pricing would promote integration, and give expats more “status” as citizens of the country, you’re living in a alt-left dreamworld.
This might sound harsh, but if you think you’ll ever be anything more than a “farang” to most Thai people then you should go home now to avoid further disappointment.
In the same way immigrants are just immigrants to most in your home country, to the average earning Thai, you are just another farang with a fat wallet that allows him/her to live a privileged lifestyle in a poor country.
Thailand is a great place to live, but you and I know we’re never going to be considered citizens of the country in any way, even if we went through the hideously long process of obtaining residency.
Thailand is historically very insular. This has promoted a unity of deep national pride, patriotism and self-identification with flag and country. Anyone outside of that will always be “a farang”.
I point to the words of the Thai national anthem: The land of Thailand belongs to all the Thais, Their sovereignty has always long endured.
No matter how well I understand Thai, no matter how long I’ve had a Thai partner, no matter that my child is half-Thai and no matter how many Thai friends I have, I am, and always will be, a farang. And this is a classification I accept as part of being a foreigner living in a foreign country.
I can’t roll up to Doi Suthep temple in Chiang Mai and say, “Can I pay the Thai price to get in because my wife is Thai?” Or, “Can I pay the Thai price because I’ve poured countless pounds into the Thai economy over the last seven years”. No, because I am not Thai.
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An Ethical But Contentious Reason for the “Thai Price”
The reality is that dual pricing has evolved with Thailand; its existence is a natural one that evolved from the market/bartering culture — as it has done in numerous Asian and Middle-Eastern countries. Friends, family and regulars tend to pay less. It's quite simple.
The same is true in some countries of Europe. Ever been to Italy? Go to the market with a local and I guarantee you will get that handbag much, much cheaper! See Greece for reference too.
Where entry to attractions and heritage sites is concerned, it has to be considered that the pricing is based on economics and not prejudice. The average wage is less than 10,000 Baht a month, and most Thais are earning little more than 300-400 Baht a day.
So, let's say I want to take my wife and daughter to a museum on the weekend, and an average earning Thai guy wants to take his family too. If I earn 150,000 Baht a month, and he earns 15,000 Baht, and the entry fee is 300 Baht for adults, he needs to spend more than a day's wages for an outing that every father can easily afford for his family.
In short, I don't mind if his and his wife's entry is subsidised by the government and that they only pay 100 Baht each to get in.
Who would have a problem with that?
Who would have a problem with paying a little more than someone else because they earn 10x more, if it meant their family could enjoy the same social outing?
If I am asked to pay more than the average Thai for entry to certain places because I earn more then I don't mind — if that little bit more is kept at a reasonable ratio.
I am privileged to be able to afford to live here and consistently enjoy myself in nice hotels and swim in the waters of beautiful beaches, and to visit amazing temples and see wonderful landscapes.
The majority of Thais will never be able to take such a holiday in a foreign land. In fact, the majority of Thais have never visited the beautiful islands and wonderful corners of their own country.
So I don’t mind that I pay 100 Baht more for entry to a museum, or 50 Baht more for a t-shirt at the market by the beach.
As a resident (I don’t have official residency) I am privileged to live in a nice apartment, and to be able to afford to eat in lovely restaurants and enjoy all the city has to offer. Again, way above and beyond the means of the average Thai person.
When I say the average Thai, I am referring to the 17 million Thais who earn under ten thousand Baht per month, most of whom, according to a recent bank survey, are in debt to the tune of an average of 150,000 Baht; debt that continues to grow at between 6-20% depending on the mood of the debtor’s loan shark.
Even the lowest paid expat jobs in Thailand massively outweigh the average Thai wage; so should we continue to grumble and begrudge those with very low salaries access to museums and local attractions at a discounted rate?
When we complain how unfair it is that a dual economy exists, we should think for a moment: do we want museums and places of cultural interest to solely be accessible to foreigners and middle/upper class Thais by there being one price for all?
Are we happy to stop the kids of an average earning Thai family going to the places we like to visit just because we feel discriminated against?
Or do we want it the other way around, where everyone pays the “Thai price”. That way, we, along with the Thai middle and upper classes, get to clasp even tighter onto our purse strings, a solution which would no doubt contribute to lowering the wages of those working for state-run museums, national parks and other places of interest.
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But What About Foreigners Who Earn Low Wages & Rich Thais Who Get Thai Price?
The big problem with the above is that there are lots of well-off Thai people who get the Thai price when they can clearly afford to pay more than the average foreigner.
But then we can’t dismiss 17 million other people on that basis, can we?
So there has to be a better way.
In a country with such huge inequality, there are sectors of society who do need a discounted rate on goods and service.
Most families can't even afford a trip to the cinema, or a take-away pizza. There is no social welfare system to speak of — no food stamps, no child benefit. Though there is a good 30-Baht health scheme.
It is also problematic for those foreign nationals who earn very little too. I was shocked to see that some of the agencies on my job board were offering such low wages to Filipino teachers. They too, like most Thais, would struggle to live on such wages in Thailand.
So that begs the question: Could this whole dual pricing thing be solved with a simple card scheme?
For example: If you earn under x, you get a card that entitles you to y at a discounted rate. y being entry to national parks, museums and other places of entertainment run by private companies that could sign up to the scheme too.
Thoughts Going Forward…
I have never bought into the notion that dual pricing is a prejudicial war on foreigners. It is something that has been evolved and become outdated. In rural communities and market trading circles it has historical roots in the barter economy — as it does in many other countries.
Things have levelled out somewhat over the past few years, though, and vendors often make a point of telling customers (Thais included) that it's “same price” for all.
But where market shopping in tourist areas is concerned, a deal can usually be struck outside of the given price on most things. And would we want that aspect of tiered pricing to disappear? Many tourists enjoy this aspect of holidaying in Thailand.
In the immediate term, if you live in Thailand and want to avoid paying more than the locals, you should definitely learn to speak Thai so that you can engage with sellers in their native language.
By making a little effort to learn the language, you’ll be able to bridge the gap and integrate more with the local community. You’ll be able to strike up a conversation and ask for “Laka con Thai” (Thai price).
Think how you feel about foreigners who don't bother to learn the language in your home country. If you live in Thailand but speak no Thai, how can you expect to be perceived as anything else other than “just another foreigner” enjoying the fruits of the country but with no interest in learning the language?
Back to the main point of disgruntlement though: Prices have been creeping up for foreigners over the past few years, with entry to some historical sites at least 2-3 times the Thai price. This has to stop; simply because it creates ill-feeling, and because not all foreigners earn 2-3 times that of the average earning Thai.
I suggest that the authorities get rid of dual pricing and look at creating a scheme where access to museums, national heritage sites, local attractions and some other goods and services are provided cheaper to those below a certain income threshold.
This will enable poorer families, both Thai and foreign, to have more freedom; to take the kids out to events and activities on the weekend.
It would also enable poorer families to save more money. And who knows, one day they may be able to start a pension, send the kids to university, or at the very least enjoy a holiday to the beach in their own country, or a trip to the cinema once in a while.
Updated: September 2017.
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David says
The correct term is 'pricing discrimination'.
It's rampant and it's wrong.
Even TAT admitted to me that this wretched practice is illegal.
Will they lift a finger to eliminate it?
No way, mainly because it gives Thais the 'upper hand'.
May 03, 2018 at 7:13 pm
James E says
In most places - be it farang price or gringo price or haole price or gaijin price or tourist price or sale price - the cards are stacked against people who either don't know how to work the system or don't try to learn. I got taken in a taxi scheme in France one time, and then learned the system.
It happens in Thailand, it happens in the US, it happens everywhere. It leaves people who get "taken" feeling miserable, and turns people who have learned how to work the system - like myself - into smug, preachy, A$$es! :)
May 03, 2018 at 10:49 pm
David says
It is discrimination and it is wrong.
Murder is practised all over the world too. So that's OK?
Weak-kneed apologists will accept discrimination; I'm one of many who don't.
May 03, 2018 at 11:03 pm
James E says
The argument comes down to are you somebody who expects others to guarantee your right to a fair price or are you willing to accept responsibility for getting what you feel is a fair price?
I'm of the latter group and (luckily) have never felt like I got screwed over by a vendor and have never paid more than I felt was fair. I've also walked away from things I might have wanted to buy because the sellers felt they were able to get their price from some other target, er, custiomer.
I have said (elsewhere in this thread) that I have no problem paying more for cultural and park fees. My extra 100 baht or whatever is the price I pay for not having to pay taxes in Thailand and doesn't make me feel discriminated against in the slightest. (I'm also aware of the many free things the Thai government funds that I'm more than happy to take advantage of.)
I'm not apologizing for the system, it is the way the whole world works outside of the nanny-state residue of failed empires. Thriving within that system is just a matter of whether you're too weak-kneed to stand up for your own principles, or not.
May 04, 2018 at 5:42 am
Ron says
And here in Thailand it is also illegal.
Like pink marshmellows, some just soak up the insult; I don't.
I've made my point.
No need for me to say any more.
Except ...................
Today I went to a waterfall.
Thai entry was 20 baht.
'Aliens' was 120 baht.
We had a friendly and polite discussion in Thai about 'discrimination'.
15 minutes later I was at the base of the waterfall no having paid the discriminatory 120 baht or even the 20 baht.
THEY LET ME IN FOR FREE.
Point made.
May 04, 2018 at 3:57 pm
James E says
That's exactly what I'm talking about! Knowing the system and even trying to work within it (making the effort to learn Thai at a minimum) allows you to show that you're in the game with them, not against them. I've had similar experiences (although I've also been chased down by a park ranger on a motorcycle to cough up the extra 100) with extra things dropped into my bag by a vendor or a free treat at a street food cart. It's your attitude about the system and your demeanor in discussions/negotiations/general interactions.
And I do beg to differ on the underlying assumption that discrimination is illegal in Thailand. While enshrined in the constitution (Section 27 of the 2017 edition) the non-discrimination clause is buffered by the word "unjust". This means 1) that discrimination is okay as long as it's not prejudicial and 2) forces the burden of proof onto the person who feels discriminated against. It also doesn't specify anything beyond the rights granted in the constitution and applies specifically "to the Thai People" (Title, Chapter III). So, under the law, we are fair game.
May 04, 2018 at 10:39 pm
Joshua says
Jan 18, 2018 at 10:34 pm
Nate says
May 07, 2018 at 5:28 pm
Brad says
"Unjust discrimination against a person on the grounds of differences in origin, race, language, sex, age, disability, physical or health condition, personal status, economic and social standing, religious belief, education, or political view which is not contrary to the provisions of the Constitution, or on any other grounds shall not be permitted."
National parks are a federal concern and last week I saw the following pricing in regards entering Doi Inthanon national park:
Thai 50 baht
Foreigner 300 baht (Thai licence not accepted)
Car 30 baht
That meant that our car with 3 farang and 1 Thai cost 980 baht or $40 AUD. Australia's most expensive national park is $29 per vehicle per day... what went wrong, Australia is a much wealthier country?
I now draw your attention to a more locally managed venue. The temples in Chiang Mai and Doi Suthep. In this case I could use my Thai licence to gain free entry where the fee was 30 or 40 baht for foreign.
Your argument about the old school using barter and hence dual pricing doesn't wash in these examples.
Nov 25, 2017 at 10:54 am
TheThailandLife says
Nov 26, 2017 at 4:50 am
Brad says
On the other hand I disagree that giving the poor more money will nesasarily give them a leg up. Trouble is they squander any windfall and don't generally plan much past their next meal. They require better fiscal maturity not just more money.
Nov 26, 2017 at 8:58 am
TheThailandLife says
Nov 27, 2017 at 6:34 pm
James E says
Note that nowhere in that quote from the Constitution is the word "citizenship".
Nov 26, 2017 at 5:02 am
Brad says
Nov 26, 2017 at 9:21 am
James E. says
The way I look at it is like this: When I fly into Thailand I am usually allowed to walk right in. Stamp-stamp, without even a glance from customs. If I were Thai, and tried to enter the US like that, I'd be detained, questioned and deported. To get in legally I would have to apply for a tourist visa (US$160), go for an interview, and be able to prove I will need to leave the country. That is discrimination.
So, do I mind - as a non-Thai taxpayer - shelling out a few baht more while somebody who pays taxes there slides in for less (national parks) or free (Grand Palace)? Nope. I don't see that as discrimination any more than I consider a tourist tax applied to a hotel room or attraction elsewhere in the world as discrimination. It's a fee or tax or whatever to help pay for the construction and maintenance of public facilities that I will use, but haven't paid for with my taxes. (Yeah, and all the corruption and kickbacks to the local government but don't let me get started on that...)
As for farang pricing out in the commercial world, that's just part of the game and if the hapless tourist wanders up with that deer-in-the-headlights-look then they should just consider the result as Lesson 1.
Nov 26, 2017 at 11:43 pm
Brad says
But... it does say "...unjust discrimination...", so perhaps the discrimination on pricing is indeed "just".
Thoughts?
Nov 28, 2017 at 10:54 am
James E says
Thai people are of many different ethnic origins but were brought together by the force of arms (in the post-Ayutthya era) and became Thai with a shared mythology and language. It is indeed possible for a farang to become Thai but I seem to remember something about it being easier to get a camel through the eye of a needle... The driver's license thing has always been problematic as it is not considered an ID that proves anything. To be Thai you need an ID card and passport. Sometimes the DL thing works, sometimes it doesn't. But if you had a DL and fluent Thai I bet you'd get into a lot more places than with either one alone.
The constitution (as proposed), as most constitutions do, lays out the rights and responsibilities of participants in Thai society, This is by-and-large the rights of citizens, not visitors, and like most constitutions stays away from commercial concerns and sticks with matters of rights, law and how the government is structured and managed.
Somebody from out of the country might be willing to try and get the rights extended to them but I don't think that case would get very far.
The pricing thing is not really - IMO, anyway, discrimination. It's the difference between being a tax-paying citizen and a non-tax-paying foreigner. I realize that some foreigners are also paying taxes if they're there under a Visa and working or getting income from investing and then the price differential for government facilities could be considered unfair. But nobody ever guaranteed life was supposed to be fair.
As far as commercial price discrimination, that's just part of the game. You either play it well and get good prices and meet some great people, or you play it poorly and go away empty-handed, grumbling, and leaving a whole lot of people with some fun stories to tell at lunch.
Nov 28, 2017 at 1:03 pm
Brad says
No, I don't pay income tax in Thailand, Australia has a tax treaty with Thailand, and so my income and income tax is handled in Australia. However, I do pay Thai VAT so technically I pay tax in Thailand.
I also think that Thailand does well out of expats. If I'm bringing in, say 50,000 baht a month, that's like free money for Thailand. I didn't cost Thailand a satang in medical or education expenses. One guy doesn't do much but multiply by hundreds of thousands of expats.
For these reasons I am a believer in countries with good immigration intakes, even if that means relative easy of being an expat.
Nov 29, 2017 at 1:59 pm
Brad says
Nov 29, 2017 at 2:03 pm
James E says
I agree with you about how it should be, but we, as guests wherever we go, have to learn how things are done wherever we are and adapt. I have never lived anywhere where my not being local didn't place a target on my wallet. I have also not lived anywhere where, once I learned the local rules and at least made an effort to follow them, that I wasn't accepted and treated with respect. My take on the dual pricing dilemma is just go with it, and be prepared to play the game.
Nov 29, 2017 at 11:20 pm
Tide Seell says
Thais are citizens of a 3rd world country who want to enter the US, where the streets are paved with gold- and very probably never leave.
Whereas US citizens are more likely to enter Thailand as tourists, spend money, have a good time and then leave that corrupt den of iniquity.
May 07, 2018 at 4:41 pm
Thetruth says
Nov 25, 2017 at 7:58 am
TheThailandLife says
Nov 26, 2017 at 4:53 am
Sarrak says
Aug 29, 2017 at 9:14 am
TheThailandLife says
Aug 29, 2017 at 6:13 pm
Tommy says
While different measures rank countries slightly differently, a quick glance at the HDI places Thailand 87 out of 188 countries. There are many countries with a much lower level of income than Thailand. And even in comparatively wealthy countries, income inequality exists. There are people in my country (Canada) who make about the same monthly amount as a middle class Thai. I'm one of them. Why should I have to pay so much more than a Thai who earns the same amount as me?
Aug 29, 2017 at 1:10 am
TheThailandLife says
Aug 29, 2017 at 6:13 pm
Tide Swell says
Talk about fawning, grovelling claptrap!
This system of "dual pricing" which has official backing is nothing more than divisive and racist. I can understand a street hawker, snack seller, or market stall holder charging (or attempting to charge) a Westerner more than a Thai - that's all part of the game.
Especially in Asia.
But where the dual pricing has official approval, e.g. entry to National Parks, that really sticks in the craw.
Foreigners who live in Thailand, or who have retired there and, above all, are living in the country legally, should NOT have to pay a penny more than a Thai person.
All that bullcrap about earning 10x more than a Thai person and therefore expecting to pay more for goods and services than a Thai person, is simply that...bullcrap.
I fully support people like Richard above, who refuse to support this perniciously evil system.
Jun 14, 2017 at 7:20 am
Jimmy says
You may be able to afford to pay farang price, not all farangs living here earn lots of money, teachers for example.
May 04, 2017 at 4:12 pm
TheThailandLife says
May 04, 2017 at 4:15 pm
James says
But your article really nails it. It is our obligation as outsiders to fit into the Thai culture. It's not their obligation to bend the rules for us. You did neglect to mention that wealthier Thais also pre-pay their Thai price to historical venues, parks, and museums by paying taxes. Something we farang try to avoid to the point of standing in line at Suvarnabhumi for a quarter-hour to get our 200 baht VAT refund. Screw that.
As visitors - even if you're lucky enough to live in Thailand - support the freaking economy. Learn to speak Thai - even a little. Talk to the vendors in the market and go back to visit the ones who are accepting of your linguistic incompetence. The others will notice and try harder. Pretty soon you won't just be that striped-shirt, backpack-swinging, insanely-loud farang but you'll be that very nice striped-shirt, backpack-swinging, insanely-loud farang.
May 04, 2017 at 10:00 pm
David Carroway says
May 17, 2017 at 7:20 pm
James says
May 18, 2017 at 2:58 am
Tide Swell says
Yeah, sure you do...
Jun 14, 2017 at 10:49 am
Tide Swell says
Why on earth should I learn one word of their language? If Thais want to talk to me - or me with them - then they can jolly well speak English.
A language spoken by most civilized, educated people the world over.
What percentage of the world's population speak Thai, compared to those who speak English?
And as for "fitting into the Thai culture.." words fail me.
Why would any God-fearing Westerner want to do that?
Jun 14, 2017 at 7:28 am
James says
And, yes, I thank all things holy that you do not as well.
Jun 14, 2017 at 10:15 am
TheThailandLife says
"I landed in Siam and saw lots of little brown people. They spoke a strange language and did ghastly things like sitting on the floor when they ate. We quickly began to civilize them by teaching them to speak English, making them drink tea and beating them with sticks".
Great trolling!
Jun 14, 2017 at 3:12 pm
Tide Swell says
Jun 14, 2017 at 8:36 pm
TheThailandLife says
Do you even know where the first alphabet was developed? The first languages? The first educational institutions?
What type of "white man" are you referring to?
Seriously though, cut out the eugenics movement crap and stop insulting people. First warning issued as per the website terms.
Jun 14, 2017 at 8:51 pm
Tide Swell says
The Thais will have to be dragged kicking and screaming into the 21st century to understand this simple fact.
Jul 09, 2018 at 2:56 am
Kip says
Mar 07, 2017 at 11:05 pm
TheThailandLife says
Mar 07, 2017 at 11:24 pm
Hofat d'Amato says
Aug 01, 2017 at 6:57 am
TheThailandLife says
Aug 01, 2017 at 4:04 pm
Sam says
Feb 08, 2017 at 7:47 pm