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O-A Long-Stay Visa Guide: Benefits, Requirements, Reporting

The O-A visa is issued to those over 50 years old and provides a long-stay option in Thailand. It's often referred to as a “retirement visa”.

This visa is applied for in your home country, at a local Thai embassy or consulate. The application can usually be done by mail and takes a minimum of 15 days to process.

In this post, I'll run through the benefits of the visa and the requirements you need to meet to be approved.

O-A-visa-thailand

Beautiful Koh Lanta. Image credit: Wojciech Portnicki

O-A Visa Benefits

The visa is active from the date of issue. You are granted a 1-year stay from the date of entry to Thailand.

This is a multiple entry visa. What that means is: you can leave Thailand and re-enter as and when you please, within the validity of the visa.

The great thing about the O-A visa is that the multiple entry aspect allows a further one year stay on any entry, so if you exit and re-enter just before the visa expires you get another one year's stay.

When your visa has expired and your permitted stay inside the country is coming to an end, you can extend the visa inside Thailand, at an immigration office. A little more about that later on.

O-A Visa Required Documents

There's a fair bit of documentation to get together. Here's what you will need to submit to your local Thai embassy or consulate.

  1. Your passport and a copy of your passport. Your passport must have validity of at least 18 months and have at least one empty page.
  2. The visa completed application form (in black or blue ink).
  3. A medical certificate (notarized) showing no prohibitive diseases in accordance with the Ministerial Regulation No.14(B.E. 2535).
  4. Three passport-size photographs (2″x2″). Photographs must have a lightly color background with a full-face view of the person with no hat or dark glasses. Photos must be no more than 6 months old.
  5. Bank statement showing a deposit of the amount equal to and not less than 800,000 Baht, or an income certificate (original not a copy) with a monthly income of not less than
    65,000 Baht, or a deposit account plus a monthly income totaling not less than 800,000 Baht. Submitting a bank statement requires a letter of guarantee from the bank (original not a copy).
  6. A letter of verification from the relevant authority in your country to show that you have no criminal record. Internet documents are not accepted.
  7. A copy of your airline tickets.
  8. The required health insurance (as discussed below)

O-A Health Insurance Requirement

The O-A visa has a mandatory health insurance requirement. The policy must cover a minimum 440,000 Baht, or the equivalent if the policy is issued outside of Thailand.

The total must cover inpatient services.

The policy can be obtained from a Thai or foreign insurance company, and must state that you are medically insured for the period, with the aforementioned coverage.

If you use a foreign insurance company, you will need to provide the original policy and two copies. You will also need to get the insurance company to fill out and stamp a form, which can be seen here.

If you use a Thai company, you will only have to provide the two copies.

The easiest option is to take out your insurance with a reputable Thai company, although one with English-speaking customer service is highly preferable.

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O-A for Your Spouse

If you have a spouse over the age of 50, she/he can apply for an O-A visa too.

If your spouse is younger than 50, he or she can apply for temporary stay under the Category ‘O’ visa. He or she will need to provide your marriage certificate as evidence.

90-Day Reporting

All long stay visas come with a 90-day reporting requirement, which involves producing a number of documents for immigration.

You can report in person, by mail and online. In person is easiest, but when working, the online system is convenient, particularly if you live far from an immigration office.

The reporting requires the following documents:

  • Passport
  • Notification form (TM47)
  • Copy of passport info page (with photo, name, passport number, etc.)
  • Copy of current visa
  • Copy of latest entry stamp
  • Copy of latest visa extension
  • Copy of departure card (TM6)
  • Copy of previous 90-day slip (if any)

Extending Your Stay Inside Thailand

As mentioned previously, you can extend your stay in Thailand beyond the validity of your visa. But don't wait for your visa to run out to do this. Instead, start the process 30 days beforehand.

This extension requires you to prove an income of 65k Baht per month income by way of a confirmation of income letter from your embassy, or 800k in a local Thai bank account 3 months prior to the application. The latter requires a confirmation letter from the bank and a copy of your bank passbook.

You will also need to fill out a TM7 (extension of stay form).

At this point it is worth noting that you can avoid applying for an O-A visa in your home country and instead obtain a long stay by doing this exact extension process in Thailand.

So instead of applying for an O-A Visa, you would apply for a Non Immigrant O Visa at your local Thai embassy or consulate instead.

The Non Immigrant O Visa gives you a 90-day stay on arrival. Before this expires inside Thailand (up to 30 days), you can do the one year extension at an immigration office.

So if you'd rather avoid applying for the O-A visa in your home country and having to provide the medical certificate, criminal record check, and the insurance requirement, you can take this alternative route.

I've written about this type of “retirement visa” extension here.

In Summary

The route a person takes to obtaining a long stay usually depends on the timeframe they are working with and how quickly they want to get to Thailand.

Applying for an O-A visa in your home country does have its benefits: You get stamped in for a year as soon as you enter, and you can exit and re-enter just before your visa expires and get stamped in for another year.

Some people would rather just have everything sorted before they leave and not have to think about doing an extension of stay in Thailand, whereas others may want to avoid that criminal record check (ahem).

I appreciate that if you're applying for a visa for the first time there may be some confusion and questions. So feel free to ask away in the comments section below.

———–

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  1. Jason Dwyer says

    Hi i am a little confused. I am an Australian living in AUS and looking to possibly move to Thailand to be with my girlfriend.
    What is the best way to obtain an O Visa and is that the correct Visa ?.
    Would it be to apply for it once i am in Thailand ?
    Or Apply before I leave AUS then extend it for 1 year once i arrive ?
    I believe Australians can travel without a Visa to Thailand for 60 days ?
    Also do you have any idea on the prices of the Visas ?

    Thanks in advance.
    Reply

    • TheThailandLife says

      Hi Jason, is your girlfriend Thai, and are you married? Are 50+ years old? This will help determine what Non-O visa you could get. If married to a Thai you could get one based on marriage. If 50+ you can get one based on retirement.Presently, Australians can travel to Thailand without a visa and get a 60-day stamp on arrival. This can also be extended for 30 days at a Thai immigration office, giving you a 90-day stay, or just short of because you will extend before your 60 days is up. See here: https://www.thethailandlife.com/thailand-visa-exemption-stamp
      Reply

      • Jason Dwyer says

        Thail girlfriend and looking to marry. I am extremely confused with all the different visa types but retiring, long term or marriage it sounds like I must maintain 800,000baht basically all the time and have private health insurance at all times ?
        Reply

        • TheThailandLife says

          For the retirement visa, if you go down the route of getting a Non-immigrant O visa (which is single entry, 90-day) you can then do the retirement visa extension (1-year, renewable) in Thailand and avoid the need for health insurance, which is a requirement under the O-A visa. Please see full details here: https://www.thethailandlife.com/the-thailand-retirement-visa-guideOnce married, you can apply for the same type of extension based on marriage. Please see here: https://www.thethailandlife.com/thai-marriage-visaThe difference between the two is the financial requirement and documents required to initially secure the Non O visa to travel and enter Thailand, and then to do the extension inside Thailand.Once you have completed your 1-year extension of stay based on either retirement or marriage you will need to do 90-day reporting. Please see information on that here: https://www.thethailandlife.com/90-day-reporting
          Reply

          • Jason Dwyer says

            hi again mate thanks so much for your amazing help so far and I really appreciate your knowledge and your time 🙏.
            so it sounds like a non immigrant O retirement extended for 1 year is the way in the begining.
            The difference between the non immigrant O retirement and marriage visa is only maintaining 400000 bath for marriage in your account Vers 800000 for non immigrant retirement is this correct ?
            you mentioned no need for health insurance for non immigrant O visa is that even with 1 year extension ?
            Is the health insurance a requirement for a marriage visa ?
            welcome to email me if that is easier for you if you have my email via this website 🙏
            Reply

  2. Russell Grimes says

    I have applied and received an O-A visa many times in the past. I am currently reviewing what is required to apply for a new O-A visa but, it appears that there is no direction about notarizing certain documents. Has that requirement been eliminated? I use the Las Angeles Cal. Thai Consulate and they tell me figure it out for myself. They are not Thais responding in that manner they are USA citizens. So what do you say about notary.
    Reply

  3. Paul Haynes says

    Hi l plan to return to Thailand mid November this year , l have a retirement visa which expires 27th February 2025, when l return do l have to report to immigration in Hua Hin immediately or 90 days after arriving. My other more important question is l have reduced my 800k to below 300k as l do not wish to renew this visa , can l stop in Thailand until 27th February or will this not be possible because of the funds have now dropped to 300k. Many Thanks Paul Haynes
    Reply

  4. Carole Montana says

    Hello

    im currently workong here in BKK and over 50. I have a business visa purchases through my school as I am working as a marketing mananger. However it will not be renwed in October 2024.

    I am about to sell a property in the U.K and will have a substantial amount to deposit in a bank here i will not have an income coming in from the U.K.

    I want to stay in Thailnd for another two years do you have any sugestions.
    Reply

    • JamesE says

      The O-A, IMO, is good for one thing: a stay in Thailand for roughly two years. You can get the O-A using funds in your home financial institution, a criminal background check, and a medical statement saying you don't suffer from any 19th Century diseases. Downside is that you have to have health insurance (which you might want anyway) and you have to do a border run to secure the second year. Otherwise, the best solution is an O (Retirement), which is a 90-day visa extendable indefinitely in one year increments. Have a look at TTL's post here: https://www.thethailandlife.com/thai-visa-requirements
      Reply

      • Natalie says

        Hi there, I’m currently on the long stay O-A visa which comes to an end in July 2024. So can I just pop out of the country of a week then come back and they automatically re stamp my passport for another year without providing any new paperwork? Kind regards Natalie
        Reply

        • JamesE says

          Yes, but make sure you get a re-entry permit first. On your return, you'll have to show health insurance for the entire period you'll be stamped in for. Also, in case you haven't considered this, is it the O-A visa which expires in July or is it your permission to stay which is what is stamped in your passport? The visa clock begins on the date it is issued but your permission to stay starts when you arrive in the country.
          Reply

          • Natslie says

            Thanks so much for replying. It’s my stamp that expires end of July, not sure on my visa will have go check. Would my hubby have to get a re entry permit as he’s on the guardian visa? Sorry another question!!!! My health ins runs out November would I need to update that before I leave? Thanks again James for taking the time answering my questions
            Reply

            • JamesE says

              If his visa is not already multi-entry then yes, he'll need a re-entry permit. Health insurance for an O-A is a limiting factor. If your current plan expires in November, you will only be stamped in until November. So the insurance extension doesn't need to happen before you leave but does need to be in place before you return.
              Reply

  5. Richard says

    I’m getting ready to hire Thai Visa Experts in Bangkok to convert my 60 day single entry Visa to a Non Immigrant O good for a total duration of 15 months. They claim three things
    1- They both open a bank account and get you the Visa the same day, there is no need for them to hold your passport
    2- They will show the required 800,000 baht for you thus allowing you to transfer the money in at your convenience
    3- They will also provide a reentry permit if necessary

    They are very responsive and they actual answer your questions in perfect English. They are a little pricey but you are done with the whole thing in one day and can get on with your life.

    I was wondering if anyone has had actual experience with them
    Reply

      • Richard says

        Their cost is higher then alternatives I’ve read about in Pattaya for instance. Thai Visa Experts charge 45k baht for the Visa, 8k for opening the bank account, 4800 baht for the reentry Visa, so around $US 1800 more or less. This is almost $US1000 more then alternatives in Pattaya for instance. Part of the difference is that Thai Visa Experts supposedly completes the entire process in one day. In Pattaya it is not uncommon for the agents to have to hold your passport for 30 days. As to your question about the renewal. From my understanding, you would have to properly fund the bank account with your own money as required by the regulations before the renewal date. But with Thai Expert Visas you can do that at your own convenience sometime after the bank account has been opened.
        None of this matters of course if the agent is not reliable and not able to do what they claim. It’s Thailand, buyer beware. I have a month basically to try and figure out if this agent is real and can deliver.
        Reply

        • Ken F says

          Those prices sound crazy steep to me. I only paid 27,000 baht total for my visa service in Phuket and that included them assisting me in getting my bank account set up with Bangkok Bank. I did not get the multiple entry at the time as I did not plan on traveling that year but if I had I believe it would have cost me an extra 4000 baht. Furthermore, at the prices you are considering paying it seems to me that it would be much cheaper just to exit the country and apply for a proper non-o visa before coming back in. So, why not just do everything the right way and save some money in the process?

          Anyway, one thing I forget to mention in my previous reply is that if you take the route you are thinking of taking just make sure you are mentally prepared for the worst-case scenario. In other words, if it turns out that the visa service you are using is doing something highly illegal rather than just exploiting a legal loophole, then you need to be prepared to face the consequences in the unlikely event that there is some sort of crackdown that exposes these illegal activities. Thai people who take these kinds of shortcuts of course – such as buying a drivers license rather than actually taking the test – don’t really think about any possible consequences. For example, I’m sure that the corrupt Thai cops who take bribes don’t spend a minute of their days worrying about some possible government crackdown. As far as they are concerned that is just how things are done in their country and so they don’t worry about it. But as a foreigner and potential expat you always have to think about these things as you could end up in a lot of hot water down the road and could even get blacklisted from the country entirely. In my case, when I first decided to use a visa services agent I had gotten into a situation in which I really had no other choice – particularly since covid restrictions prevented me from traveling to any neighboring countries at the time. Still, I not only carefully calculated the odds of something going wrong, but I also mentally prepared myself for the possible consequences in the unlikely event that something did go wrong, and I was fully prepared to accept those consequences. By the way, the second time I used the service it was purely for convenience's sake. Also, I just did not want to take the financial hit associated with pulling $20,000 from my investments and putting it in a Thai bank account for a year. Money should always be put to work to make you more money and it should never be just sitting on the sidelines doing nothing.
          Reply

          • Richard says

            Hi Ken….I have to say, your suggestion has crossed my mind more then once. Had I known that the process was so complicated I would have done exactly as you suggested and jumped through all the hoops in my home country. But to take a step back now, in terms of reservations and flights would be disruptive as well.
            My hope is that this shortcut works out and by being in full legal compliance in terms of funding within a matter of months will not have any long term consequences. I spent 30 minutes on the phone with the VisaAgent I’m going to use and actually came away confident in them and the probability of a successful outcome.
            Reply

    • JamesE says

      No experience but several of your bullet points are a field of red flags. First it is illegal in Thailand to open an account for somebody else. If it's something that they do with you present and just know which skids to grease, that's one thing. But if you don't need to be there then that's a whole 'nother can of worms. Second, it's not just ฿800K. It's ฿800K that you can prove was transferred into the country from overseas. Again, this smacks of money changing hands under the table.

      So, they get you an O-Retirement - 90 days, fine. But then the 1 year extension has to be done before those 90 days are up. Are they claiming you get both - the full 15 months - the same day?

      I know these shady agents are out there, and I know people successfully get away with using them but, in the current climate of visa abuse crackdown, do you really want to risk your retirement (and the money you'll pay) just to save a few hours out of a couple of days?

      Were I you, I'd look into hiring an agent that will walk you through the process and show you how to do it yourself next time. It'll be cheaper, safer, and, with all the money you'll save, could pay for a nice vacation someplace.
      Reply

      • Richard says

        Hi James…. I have all the same concerns. I’m trying to cut corners by using an agent but stay within the legitimate boundaries of the process longer term. For the bank account for instance, I would be present and have proper ID. For the 800k baht, I would have the agent advance the funds but wire in my own funds from outside of Thailand within a few months of getting the whole thing set up. So by month four at the latest I’d be in complete compliance with the rules as I understand them.
        But who can deliver on their claims is what’s most difficult to determine. Based on a post on the Aseannow website I contacted ThaiVisaCentre. What was most striking about their response verses Thai Visa Expert is that while Thai Visa Experts claims to be able to open the bank account and get the Visa in one day….ThaiVisaCentre says that the first part of the process, the 3 month “temporary” Non Immigrant O takes 30 days and that the bank account opening process is a bit more complicated. Its curious what one company claims they can do in a day and a comparable company says takes much longer. One of the retirement communities I’m looking at suggested Maneerat in Pattaya as a reliable Visa agent. He’s less expensive then everyone else but requires you to leave your passport with them for 30 days which makes me feel a bit uncomfortable.
        Reply

        • JamesE says

          Hi Richard, I wouldn't be leaving my passport anywhere for 30 days! ThaiVisaCentre isn't entirely incorrect. Assuming you enter visa exempt you're given 30 days and (if I remember correctly) can't switch to the Non-O (Retirement) until you're close to the end of that permission to stay. Your conversion to the Non-O (Retirement) - not a temporary, 90 days is the actual length - is then done. Then, 90 days later, you apply for the one-year extension.

          Here are the problems I see. One - the 800K needs to be in your account 2 months before you apply for the one-year extension and it has to be documented as a foreign source transfer. That's the law and if that is not happening then something is fishy. This means the whole bank account and visa in one day is very, very fishy. Two - the whole "temporary visa" narrative is false. It's a 90-day visa that can be extended for a year annually.

          The agent Maneerat may just be holding your visa to keep you from skipping town before the check clears, as it were. I'd talk with them and see how they describe the process. I'd also suggest asking them if they offer a service whereby they allow you to come along and learn the steps of what's being done. You're going to have to do 90-day reports and annual visa extension for the rest of your stay in Thailand so you might as well learn how to work with the bureaucracy.
          Reply

          • Richard says

            Hi James….each new fragment of the process that I learned about made me more and more uncomfortable and the part about not having my passport for 30 days was the most disturbing.
            Long story short. If I get the 60 day single entry visa I applied for I’m going come over and check out the Senior Retirement Resorts in Chiang Mai and Hua Hin which is my real and long term purpose for coming to Thailand. At the end of the 60 days or 90 if I can get an extension I will return to the US and get the Non Immigrant O there. This is a long term investment in my future well being and ability to live comfortably and be economically viable. I don’t want to start off on a shaky foundation.
            Reply

            • JamesE says

              I know those retirement places have a built-in social life which may be a big draw. But, this being Thailand, you should also look into hiring a helper. Domestic help - from cleaning and cooking staff to registered nurses - is very affordable and can be - but doesn't have to be - full time from daily visits to 24/7 coverage. If you are still able to get out and about and largely fend for yourself it could be a better and more economical solution.
              Reply

              • Richard says

                Hi James….I’m keeping that as an option also. I’m still mobil and completely capable of taking care of myself. I have no idea what living at one of these Retirement Resorts is like and think this will be a good opportunity see what the experience is. The monthly cost which can run anywhere from $US2000 to $US2500 per month all inclusive ( as far as I can tell ) is about what I anticipate my cost cost of living in Thailand would be if I were on my own and hired some domestic help.
                Any suggestions where to look/advertise for someone with some Western cooking skills and other domestic services?
                Reply

                • JamesE says

                  Hi Richard, Western cooking skills... lol... YOU better have some and the ability to train somebody. (Note: once you do it will be perfect every time, but still...)

                  The absolute best way is to find the place you want to live and start asking people who live there and who have helpers. There's a rich and very deep network that always knows when somebody's available. I have a friend who has what can legitimately be called a staff and it was built up over the years with these kinds of referrals. If you're not needing full time help many people will share a trusted helper.
                  Reply

    • Ken F says

      Despite my initial trepidation I actually used this type of service two-years in a row while living in Phuket and everything worked out fine for me. I also mentioned that, although the price seemed steep at first, I quickly realized that I would be losing much more money than that by pulling 800,000 baht out of my investment portfolio and leaving it parked in a Thai bank account for a year earning diddly-squat in interest. That being said however, I really do not see how they can possibly get you a visa without hanging on to your passport even for a day. After all, how can an immigration official (possibly a corrupt one) stamp your passport if it’s in your possession the whole time? When I did mine they had my passport for about a week each time. This, by the way, is the only time in 30 years that I have ever let anyone in Thailand hang onto my passport. But then again, I did my due diligence in checking the place out before I used their services. Still, there is always the possibility that going this route could lead to some major headaches at some point down the road, even if fairly unlikely. As for the bank account they can certainly get the ball rolling on it for you but you will still need to sign all the documents associated with the account. In my case they had a Bangkok Bank employee meet me at their office with all the paperwork for me to sign and to give me my bankbook. I think I also got my ATM card that day from her but I can’t remember for sure. Prior to this I had been banging my head against the wall trying to get a bank account on my own. I went into quite a few different banks and bank branches trying to set up an account myself but they all turned me away for a variety of different nonsensical reasons. Either that or they tried to force me to buy some pricey scam insurance policy even though I already had insurance coverage. Anyway, I'm sure some of these visa services companies are more legit than others so just do your homework before you decide to go with one of them.
      Reply

      • Richard says

        Ken….I had the same issue. I just bought a 4.65% 7 year US treasury and 5 year non callable CDs in the US are getting close to cracking 5% again. But here’s the flip side. If I’m really going to make the move to Thailand which is my thought right now, given how precarious everything in the world is and how even global financial networks are being weaponized for political purposes ( think how the Russians in Thailand were caught off guard by US sanctions on the SWIFT) system)…. I want to have a large pool of money in country to draw on if the whole system of fund transfers becomes unavailable for some period of time.
        The other thing that you mentioned that hit home for me is this issue of leaving your passport with one of these agents. Someone who has been recommended to me twice now is Maneerat in Pattaya. They have to hold your passport for 30 days. That causes me some real discomfort.
        As I mentioned to JamesE I want to use the agents to cut corners and speed up the process but be in total legitimate compliance with all the rules as quickly as possible so I have nothing hanging over me.
        Reply

        • Ken F says

          Yes CDs are indeed cracking 5% again - although we will likely never again see those 12% rates from the 1980’s. That being said you can now also get 5% interest with ordinary savings accounts at online banks. Actually, they are technically not banks but they operate as such and since they are FDIC insured your funds are just as safe as they would be in a brick and mortar bank. In any case, you naturally still always want to have some money in a Thai bank account. I always kept at least 150,000 baht in mine as a buffer in case I should ever have any cash flow problems. Also, I liked to have the option of living on Thai saving when the exchange rates were really bad and then only start transferring money in again when the rates went back up.

          By the way, you mentioned that you want to cut corners with the visa but that you also want to be 100% legit and I’m not sure that this is possible. It’s usually going to have to be one or the other. The for sure 100% legit services are simply going to help you get all your documents in order and walk you through the whole process. On the other hand when a place is hanging onto your passport – be it for a day or two weeks – in order to take it to immigration for you to get it stamped, then you really have no way of knowing for sure if they are simply exploiting a legal loophole or if what they are doing its totally illegal. In my case, since I got the visa without having to transfer the 800,000 baht in, there is of course a distinct possibility that what they are doing may not be 100% legal. They have their little tricks and short cuts and since these are industry secrets, we have no way of knowing if they are just skirting the law or if they are actually breaking it. The bottom line is its always going to be a calculated risk using one of these visa services – although in my opinion a very, very negligible risk if you do your homework. And in any case, it's not like you are buying a forged visa from some guy in a back alley – something that would make you legally culpable. You are simply going to what appears to be a legitimate well-advertised and out in the open business which has been openly and successfully used by countless other expats for years and years.

          That being said, it's not exactly rocket science doing everything by the book yourself. And if you really want to be 100% sure that you are 100% in compliance, as you say, then you are just going to have to apply for a Non-immigrant O visa (or A-O) in your own country before you leave. This will give you an initial 90-day stay and then you just get a bank account as soon as you arrive (admittedly not always easy) and transfer the 800,000 in right away. Then before the 90-days is up you go to immigration to get a one-year extension – at which point you will have to show that the funds have been in your Thai bank account for the prescribed amount of time. The reason I mention transferring the money as soon as possible by the way is because I put it off when I first got there. Then I was disabled for a long time from a motorcycle accident and then, just as I was recovering, I got a bad case of covid which had me out of commission for a long time. Long story short, I ended up not getting my bank account in time and that is why I ended up having to use a visa agent.
          Reply

          • Richard says

            Ken, your story touches on everything that concerns me on a daily basis not just immigration to Thailand. Nothing seems safe anymore and when it comes to relying on health and well-being, whether it’s Covid, motorcycle accidents or heart attacks you just never know what’s going to come at you next.
            I’ve decided to not use the Visa Agents on this first trip. For the cost of the two companies I was considering I can fly back and forth to the US. So I’m going to use my 60 day tourist visa assuming I get it. Maybe request a 30 day extension and in February 2024 return to the US and apply for the Non Immigrant O there. If I can somehow open a bank account this first trip with a tourist visa and resident certificate I will do that, if not then not. My longer term goal is to settle my self in one of the Senior Resort Retirement places probably in Chiang Mai or Hau Hin. Peter has an article on a few of them and I want to see whether this is something that could work for and help me find a solution to that question that faces some of us “ whose going to take care of me when I can’t any longer”.
            Reply

            • Ken F says

              Just because I had a bit of bad luck does not mean you should be particularly worried about anything. Also, contrary to popular belief, the world is not actually a more dangerous place to live in then it was in the past. In fact, its actually getting safer all the time. The only reason people feel it is unsafe is because we are constantly bombarded with bad news through various media all day long and this creates the illusion that our environment is much more dangerous than it actually is. Its true of course that it can be very dangerous to drive in Thailand but once you get used to it you should be fine. In fact, all of the motorcycle accidents I had there over the past 30 year occurred within the first week or two of coming back to Thailand after being away for many years. This is because while driving in Thailand you have to always be on the lookout for a million little things that you would never even have to consider while driving in the USA and it takes time to make this adjustment. In other words, you have to fine-tune your radar for the chaotic and lawless driving and road conditions there, and this can sometimes take a week or two. You also have to look out for the many blatantly and purposefully reckless drivers, and in Phuket the majority of these are actually other Westerners these days.

              As for having someone to take care of you when you cannot take care of yourself, I have never really worried about this myself. For one thing I have always had girlfriends who would take care of me if I were temporarily disabled. And secondly, if the day ever comes when I permanently cannot take care of myself and have to rely on others, well my friend, that is the day that I check out for good. Nothing messy, painful, or otherwise unpleasant, mind you – just a full-face scuba mask with regulator and a bottle of nitrogen.

              Anyway, if you want something to worry about, I would worry more about the possibility of wanting to return to your own country after many years in Thailand. Believe it or not, its a heck of a lot easier to get set up in Thailand than it is to get set up back in the USA these days. And I am currently learning this the hard way. For example, I have been spending a fortune over the past two months to stay in a hotel because nobody will rent me an apartment here until I have a job. In the old days, when coming back from several years abroad I could always find a place within a few days as long as I had plenty of money in the bank. But things have changed drastically over the past decade. Basically, up until recently, you were dealing with apartment managers or individual owners but now all the rentals are operated by property management companies with very strict rules that they will not bend for anyone. In fact, you could quite literally have a million dollars in the bank, and they would still not rent to you unless you have had a job for at least 3 months in which you make at least 2.5 to 3 times the monthly rental rate. Not only that but they will not even show you the apartment until you fill out an application and pay a non-refundable fee for them to do a credit check and a background check on you. This means that if you have to look at ten places before finally deciding on one you like you could end up paying hundreds of dollars in fees that you would not get back. In Thailand on the other hand there is no need to go through an insanely detailed and complex applications process. In fact, they might not even ask how much money you make. They just show you the place and if you like it you pay a deposit and move in. Of course, after seeing staff trying to evict non-paying foreigners at several condos, I’m thinking that perhaps they should be a bit stricter about these things.

              In any case, despite all the nightmarish problems I am encountering trying to get myself set back up here in California, not a day goes by that I am not thrilled to be back.
              Reply

              • Richard says

                Interesting….I haven’t lived in the US for five years and wouldn’t go back to live there if they paid me. Though I understand what you mean about the pleasure of being someplace familiar. My change of heart about using a Visa Agent was partly driven by the warnings of you and others but the real clincher was, literally I just got off the phone with someone with ThaiVisaCentre feeling confident, when I ran into an article about the arrest of this person and her husband three years earlier for selling forged Visas. Note, I say arrested and investigated not found guilty.
                Anyhow, I’m making a long term investment in my future and don’t want to start off on shaky ground. in China there is a similar system. The Party puts an obstacle in the way of doing anything and then gives you three ways to circumvent it. I think like Thailand, it’s okay until suddenly and for no apparent reason it’s not. I don’t want to get caught up in that.
                Nitrogen in a scuba mask? I’ll have to let Death with Dignity know that they are behind the times.
                Thanks for all your input, I appreciate it.
                Reply

                • Ken F says

                  Well, I’m glad you decided to go with the Non-Immigrant O visa as that really is the smartest option. By the way, familiarity has nothing to do with why I’m glad to be back home. Infact, I’m actually someone who thrives on change and who needs to constantly experience new stimuli. Naturally this also means that I can’t really stomach stagnation or decay, and this is one of the many reasons I left Thailand. But of course, my sudden desire to leave did not come as much of a surprise. For the past 15 years in fact, I have been telling people that even though I loved my many, many lengthy stays in Thailand over the past three decades, I would likely not be happy living there permanently. Much like Hawaii, where I also lived for a time, I just think it’s a much better place to visit than to live. I could probably move back to Tokyo, Japan and live out my days there if it were not for the lousy weather, but not Thailand.

                  Anyway, this may sound silly to some but now that I’m back I actually get filled with joy simply from looking out of my 3rd floor hotel window onto the parking lot every day and seeing the perfectly smooth and uniform asphalt, the perfectly shaped curbs and walkways, and the immaculate landscaping. I like that everything around me is not in a habitual state of decay and disrepair and that things are actually done the right way and not half-assed. It also makes me feel very happy simply driving down the very wide, smooth roads with traffic that is well organized and well regulated. And of course, I can walk down sidewalks that do not look like a post-apocalyptic concrete patchwork quilt put together by 5-year-old children and which do not present a major tripping hazard every two feet. I also love the warm dry air here and not feeling like I have to take a shower every time I go outside for a mere ten minutes due to coming back feeling so hot and sticky. And the thing that makes me the most happy about being back is knowing that there are both business and social opportunities out there for me to pursue here. And even if I don’t take advantage of them right away, simply knowing that they are out there makes me happy.

                  But that’s just me and I know there are plenty of westerners out there who really enjoy living in Thailand permanently – different strokes for different folks, as they say. And if you have been fine living in China then you will probably be happy in Thailand as well. And lets face it, in China, things are also rarely done right, and they habitually cut corners on even very major construction projects. This is something which has led to countless thousands of deaths over the years by the way, but since the CCP sweeps all of this under the rug we will never really know the true numbers. Of course, in China, cutting corners is more a case of greed – the “I’m getting mine and screw everyone else” mentality – whereas in Thailand it’s more of a culturally induced and justified state of apathy concerning how things get done. Basically, Thais will always follow the path of least resistance.
                  Reply

                  • Richard says

                    I lived Hawaii also. Both upcountry in Kula and Wailea on Maui and a stint in Honolulu as well. I sometimes have regretted leaving but every year Maui felt more and more like Southern California and between taxes and the cost of living it probably would not have been a good long term answer especially during the period of 2007-2022 when interest rates were zero and yield on investment income was being crushed.
                    I used to travel extensively but these days and at my age don't find the travel part appealing at all. In fact it's something I try to minimize.
                    Short term answers are not difficult to come by but long term economically viable solutions that encompass personal safety, comfort, high quality healthcare and long term care with a bit of eroticism available for the asking are not easy to come by. I totally agree how one becomes desensitized to some of the ugliness that South East Asia and China surround you with. But everything seems to come with a drawback or compromise. How big a drawback or compromise seems to correlated with your net worth.
                    Reply

  6. Georg Schmocker says

    Hi Peter,
    i'm trying to find out to retire in Thailand, Swiss citicen 68 of age single.
    was reading on your webside about the visas, i would like to start the process
    before i move!
    would you mind to assist what i have to do ,
    sorry my business experience is not so great

    Thankx G. Schmocker
    Reply

  8. Keith Charles Wheeler says

    Hi
    I renewed my OA Visa last year had left Thailand twice but still had to provide all data insurance and 800k bank statements are you saying I need not do all that just do a boarder run
    Reply

    • Thomas Stalnaker says

      A boarder run is a complete different dog than a non o retirement visa I have a non o retirement visa I must keep 800,000thb consistently in my Thai bank account, I must go to imigration every 90 days through the drive through to get the update ticket that shows I am still in country and have not abandoned my stay it takes me 20 minutes to do this every 90 days every year of non o visa renew I need to take bank records and residence tm 30 to imigration to gain another year unlike the Philippines service visa I cannot use my 800,000 thb to buy a condo. I also have a multiple entry stamp in my passport that allows entry to Thailand if I visit other countries or return home but I must be in country for my 90 day update ticket at imigration. It is funny imigration at airport says do not need entry stamp with the non o evisa
      Reply

    • Paul Haynes says

      Hi l have a current O/A retirement visa which expires 27th February next year .l an returning to Thailand hopefully 21st November this year, using my re entry cert. My Question is when do l have to return my balance in Bangkok bank to 800.000 l have let it drop to 730.000.
      Reply

        • Thomas says

          The first year non o visa update must have 800,000 thb in bank for 2months 60 days unfettered and not showing a lesser amount at anytime, the second extension to get year number 2 the money must be in there 90 days 3 months, you can also do on income but the us e back does not certify income anymore so I will talk to my business manager in bangkok this morning and see how to do,, he is expert and has office across street from us embacy and knows everyone,, remember anything is possible in Thailand with money
          Reply

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